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How many brands of SP's are biodegradable?

Printed From: The Fishing Website
Category: Saltwater Fishing
Forum Name: Soft Bait Fishing
Forum Description: Anything to do with this latest and greatest way of catching our favourite species
URL: https://www.fishing.net.nz/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=20865
Printed Date: 23 Jul 2026 at 7:40pm


Topic: How many brands of SP's are biodegradable?
Posted By: Bushpig
Subject: How many brands of SP's are biodegradable?
Date Posted: 21 May 2007 at 8:57am
Personally I have only been useing gulp bait for SP fishing. They catch fish and are biodegradable. There are a number of people on this site heavly promotong other brands that I believe are petrochemical based. I cant help but wonder what impact this type of SP is having/going to have on the fish.

How many brands on the market are biodegradable? Has anyone used these and how did they compare to gulp?

I alse noted that one brand that is getting heavly promoted by a couple of the members here needs to be enhanced with products like stimulate. Why use something like this when you have eco friendly products that dont need to be enhanced to work?




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I would rather laugh with the Sinners, than cry with the Saints



Replies:
Posted By: Kezza
Date Posted: 21 May 2007 at 9:26am
You turning in to a fish hugger bro?

FoodSource would probably be the only other soft bait brand that is being promoted as "biodegradable" on the New Zealand market I think.....hooks, braid, nylon, sinkers, jigs, reel handles, knives and the like would have a much greater half-life than non biodegradable brands of soft baits I'd think?

I think it would be a good idea for more soft bait manufacturers to be thinking "green" thou.

PS.....which phat-muppet is using Stimulate on their non scented baits?....I never have, never will and seem to catch the odd fish? must say I've never seen it happen either, although have seen non GULP baits come out of GULP packets.


Posted By: Bushpig
Date Posted: 21 May 2007 at 9:42am
Not a fish or tree hugger. But you do have to question feeding fish petrochemical baits when there are food source SP's avaliable. Sure there are a lot of hooks etc dropped into the ocean but with the exception of hooks I doubt fish eat them.

Its the impact on the fish and its life expectancy when digesting rubber that I question.


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I would rather laugh with the Sinners, than cry with the Saints


Posted By: Peter da Squid
Date Posted: 21 May 2007 at 10:11am

upper cut for the swine of the forest!

no worse than emptying a sump full of oily water aye chief!


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Good for Nuthin


Posted By: Reel Deal
Date Posted: 21 May 2007 at 10:25am
Bushpig Im with you big time. I dont throw six pack plastic holders in the sea. I dont throw the plastic bag my bait came in into the sea, why on earth wouldnt anyone who isnt really thick, selfish with no secondary thought patterns use the best bait for their quarries enviroment.?
 
I have an idea which may get approval from some members. Why dont we pour 40 litres of desiel all over a boat ramp, it would be really funny.WackoPeter da squid might be keen for that one
 


Posted By: Bushpig
Date Posted: 21 May 2007 at 10:36am
Originally posted by Peter da Squid Peter da Squid wrote:

upper cut for the swine of the forest!

no worse than emptying a sump full of oily water aye chief!


Dont take it personally Squid. I know you like free product, but questions have to be asked.



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I would rather laugh with the Sinners, than cry with the Saints


Posted By: Redfinger
Date Posted: 21 May 2007 at 10:47am

Agree pretty much with you BP - I use gulps 80-90% of the time but must admit going to the dark side when AP starts whipping my ass on his squidgies! Only happened once though.

Also Ireally really want a big fish and AC promises me that big sluggos will work - maybe after I've caught 1-2 I'll swap back.
 
This Should encourage some debate I would think.......


Posted By: cod
Date Posted: 21 May 2007 at 10:49am
good post mr pig.


Posted By: Peter da Squid
Date Posted: 21 May 2007 at 12:11pm
real deal, you dont have a clue mate
 
bushie, no free ones mate, i buy cause i believe.
you buy me some gulps and i'll use them


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Good for Nuthin


Posted By: Reel Deal
Date Posted: 21 May 2007 at 12:17pm
 Of coarse you are right Peter Da Squid, anyhow Im off to throw my  plastic recycling off a wharf


Posted By: Peter da Squid
Date Posted: 21 May 2007 at 12:18pm
cool, if that turns ya spokes

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Good for Nuthin


Posted By: Reel Deal
Date Posted: 21 May 2007 at 12:23pm
Big%20smileBig%20smile


Posted By: Peter da Squid
Date Posted: 21 May 2007 at 12:27pm
your'e a weird bstardLOL
good O


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Good for Nuthin


Posted By: Capt Asparagus
Date Posted: 21 May 2007 at 12:29pm
Gulps certainly are. Kilwell are getting in the new range of Mr Twister "Stimulate" I think it is called, which is also a plant protien based product, hence biodegrable, just oozes oils when left in water, yet does not dry out like Gulp does if  not left in packet... looks exactly like any other silicon type SP, but is not. Interesting looking product. Could give the gulps a run for their money. Must say though, the gulps certainly do work for me!
Still, a little competition to keep everyone keen out there cannot be a bad thing.
Hate to add to the "Green" tinge of this post, but it was "Gulp"s biodegradability that really got me more interested in using SPs again.... I had used a lot of SPs for...geez, the last decade or two?.... but the thought of fish getting that crap in their guts, and then littering the sea/rivers with the plastic left me cool on it.
 
cheers, Stu.


Posted By: Badfish
Date Posted: 21 May 2007 at 12:39pm
I only know of two brands that are bio-degradable and one doesn't work for me at all.
Would be nice to see more bio-degradable ones on the market.
Im not a tree hugger but I get really pissed having to drag a sack full of rubbish back from rock hopping.

It's probably the same on the reefs but if you don't dive you wont see it, outta sight outta mind.


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http://www.legasea.co.nz" rel="nofollow">


Posted By: Finatic
Date Posted: 21 May 2007 at 12:40pm
Who's hijacked BP's handle??? Awesome topic!

Is it Japan where there are a few lakes where the shores are literally covered in plastic baits??? Wherever it is it's not good eh!

Love the Gulp! baits too. But how long does it take for a Gulp! to break down? I can't imagine it being a quick process. It mightn't take long inside a fish's gut, but an unscoffed one?...

But what happens to all the other crap in our oceans? I'm pretty sure the fish bin I collided with yesterday wouldn't be breaking down in a hurry.

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What's the cheapest type of meat? Dear balls. They're under a buck.


Posted By: Badfish
Date Posted: 21 May 2007 at 12:40pm
Those new kilwells sound very interesting, I'll be keepin pealed for those!

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http://www.legasea.co.nz" rel="nofollow">


Posted By: Reel Deal
Date Posted: 21 May 2007 at 12:48pm
Gulp are the only ones I use, and they work well, but am looking forward to some more options BA has mentioned. Ive tried that Foodsource brand but they went sticky like glue and started to desolve after 30mins Confused.
I have never used any longer than the 5 " jobbies mainly as you get more in a packet. but have heard lately that the larger ones are getting more strikes and hook ups. Anyone else noticed a difference?


Posted By: Bushpig
Date Posted: 21 May 2007 at 12:51pm
Originally posted by Capt Asparagus Capt Asparagus wrote:

Gulps certainly are. Kilwell are getting in the new range of Mr Twister "Stimulate" I think it is called, which is also a plant protien based product, hence biodegrable, just oozes oils when left in water, yet does not dry out like Gulp does if  not left in packet... looks exactly like any other silicon type SP, but is not. Interesting looking product. Could give the gulps a run for their money. Must say though, the gulps certainly do work for me!
Still, a little competition to keep everyone keen out there cannot be a bad thing.
Hate to add to the "Green" tinge of this post, but it was "Gulp"s biodegradability that really got me more interested in using SPs again.... I had used a lot of SPs for...geez, the last decade or two?.... but the thought of fish getting that crap in their guts, and then littering the sea/rivers with the plastic left me cool on it.
 
cheers, Stu.


Couldnt agree with you more Stu. This market is in need of some serious competition.


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I would rather laugh with the Sinners, than cry with the Saints


Posted By: Finatic
Date Posted: 21 May 2007 at 1:04pm
Getting some of the Wave Worms 'Tiki' scented baits from the States. They're biodegradable. Would rather buy scented SPs from NZ, but with seriously limited choices, it has to be done.

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What's the cheapest type of meat? Dear balls. They're under a buck.


Posted By: cod
Date Posted: 21 May 2007 at 1:07pm
competition would be good.bring it on.


Posted By: Bushpig
Date Posted: 21 May 2007 at 1:19pm
Originally posted by Finatic Finatic wrote:

Getting some of the Wave Worms 'Tiki' scented baits from the States. They're biodegradable. Would rather buy scented SPs from NZ, but with seriously limited choices, it has to be done.


This is a really interesting colour from that brand


http://imageshack.us">



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I would rather laugh with the Sinners, than cry with the Saints


Posted By: Finatic
Date Posted: 21 May 2007 at 1:27pm
Yeah, got some of that colour comning in the shad. Somebody mentioned somewhere "So that's what they do with the rejects... melt them down and make those"

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What's the cheapest type of meat? Dear balls. They're under a buck.


Posted By: Accident Prone
Date Posted: 21 May 2007 at 1:38pm
Sweet potatoe pie ........




Posted By: Phats
Date Posted: 21 May 2007 at 2:10pm
Hehehehe
 
Bushy Goes fishing with the Gulp guys and look at him
 
The guys making the money on this stuff must be loving getting their "sales men" out there.


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A positive attitude may not solve all your problems, but it will annoy enough people to make it worth the effort.


Posted By: Men In Black
Date Posted: 21 May 2007 at 2:44pm

WATCH THIS SPACE



Posted By: Peter da Squid
Date Posted: 21 May 2007 at 2:55pm
go hard boys, go hard!

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Good for Nuthin


Posted By: Redfinger
Date Posted: 21 May 2007 at 3:18pm
No- go soft , go soft!


Posted By: get hooked
Date Posted: 21 May 2007 at 4:09pm
Stu, and friends....
The Mister Twister product is called "Exude", (not to be confused with Stu's suggested "Stimulate" ...another product altogether.)
 
Exude releases it's scent when immersed, and stops releasing when it is pulled out of the water. The lures become slimy as the process releases/exudes.
(Quote: ........a softer, more natural lure, while releasing a proprietary scent blend of protein, minerals and amino acids found to be most effective in stimulating carnivorus fish to feed"....."Next Generation Soft Plastic".
 
HotShotz Tackle have been putting these "Exude" products on made up "ready to fish" rigs for some time now, and will now share the NZ agency with Kilwell.
 
Kilwell, will be doing packeted Exude softies in a similar format to all the other brand X's out there.
In the meantime, HotShotz will continue to rig the softies ready to fish as an NZ made product similar to a flasher rig.
HotShotz will keep bringing in the softies in bulk from Mister Twister.
 
There are now several of these made up rigs available and the range includes some unscented rigs too all with Mister Twister's on them.
 
There is life after Gulp after all!
All credit to the Pure Fishing team for putting softies on the tackle map at long last.
Amazing that NZers have all seen these soft alternatives for about three decades but a healthy 6 figure plus advertising budget is all it took to get the wheels spinning!
While the "Tackle Evangelists" are out in force doing seminars all over the place, it is prudent to now realise, MISTER TWISTER IS BACK!Big%20smileBig%20smile
 
www.hotshotztackle.com
 


Posted By: Kezza
Date Posted: 21 May 2007 at 4:15pm
"Tackle Evangelists"

....possibly the best one liner in the history of one liners!

LOL

that has brightened my day up no end.....

"I believe! I believe!!"

keep us in the loop with developments please!


Posted By: Sea-Sharpe
Date Posted: 21 May 2007 at 4:34pm

Well I suppose I better "wade in here" to put the case forward for the "petrochemical" cause.... And yea I have a vested interest but there�s two sides to every story so please hear me out.

 

Firstly let�s get rid of the emotive "petrochemical" tag from soft plastics, have you checked the price of petrol lately? Plastic can be and is made from almost anything, and most raw materials are far cheaper to produce plastic from than that made from oil based products. If you want to talk about �petrochemicals� consider where an outboards exhaust is! And who here runs a two stroke? Not pissing anyone off but there is a crapload more pollutants entering our seas than the infinitesimal amount of plastic lost by soft plastic fishermen.

 

Secondly plastics can be synthesised in the lab, or from a combination of natural elements that may or may not exist in a raw state, e.g. they may be derived from other elements also.  So what we have is a �manufactured product made from but not always synthetic products� yea they have a long shelf life but so does a lot of man made products � Glass � Concrete � Titanium - Rubber � Nuclear Waste (not chicken) the greens out there will argue that one but it�s a fact. As outlined below most soft plastics are manufactured from SILICON

 

Thirdly I�m not against Biodegradable baits, far from it in fact, I stock some Foodsource but if these things are cheap to produce why the hell do they cost so much? I know there are some more brands on the way to NZ and with luck I will try these out and maybe even stock some, if they are any good, and that in its self is an argument as I believe that plastic baits have the edge in movement at this present time!

 

Fourthly here is some info for those that care about what plastics really are:

 

In terms of angling, the term "soft plastic" is used to describe any of a range of silicon-based fishing http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Lures&action=edit - lures , termed so because of their soft, flexible rubber texture. Designed to imitate fish or other natural aquatic food sources, their realistic texture and versatility, combined with simple and economical production has led them to become a standard article of modern http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fishing_tackle - fishing tackle . Soft plastics are available in a large range of colours, sizes and particularly shapes.

History

Soft plastics found their origins in the late 1950s and early 1960s, with small worms and grubs being moulded from hard rubber. The stiff rubber used, as well as the basic shapes produced, did not allow the flexible action and effectiveness of modern soft plastics to be observed. In 1972, lure manufacturer http://www.mepps.com/mistertwister/ - Mister Twister patented the Curly Tail concept, utilising the flexibility of silicon-based plastic to create a rubber lure with a more lifelike action and vastly improved fish-catching effectiveness. By the early to mid 1980s, high sales volumes of Mister Twister lures prompted many new entrants into the market, with competition soon leading to a broad and diverse selection of soft plastic lures being made available in a range of shapes, colours and sizes.

Uses

The diversity of soft plastic lures has enabled them to be used in many configurations, rigs and with various techniques. The original, and still most commonly seen use of soft plastics is as a simple lure, using a weighted hook known as a http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/jighead - jighead . The hook of the jighead is threaded through the lure so that only the gape of the hook, and the eye, are exposed. Methods vary according to the shape of the plastic used, however is it most often cast and retrieved with short, sharp jerky motions applied by the angler through flicking the fishing rod tip. Experienced soft plastic anglers attempt to emulate the natural movement of the animal the soft plastic imitates, such as a prawn, baitfish or crawdad.

Soft plastics are also trolled and jigged in the same method as metal or hardbodied lures, and used as artificial baits in classic real-bait rigs. The many rigs, techniques and uses of soft plastic lures are as varied as the designs, colours and sizes they are available in. Specialised techniques and rigging methods have evolved from anglers targetting specific fish species or in particular areas, such as the Texas rig and Carolina rig.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Carolina-rig.jpg - - - - - - - -

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Carolina-rig.jpg -

The Carolina Rig. Various soft plastic fishing rigs and methods have evolved through anglers targetting specific fish species

 

And lastly

 

Silicon ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Phonetic_Alphabet - IPA : /ˈsɪlikən/, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Latin_language - Latin : silicium) is the http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chemical_element - chemical element that has the symbol Si and http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atomic_number - atomic number 14. A http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tetravalent - tetravalent http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metalloid - metalloid , silicon is less reactive than its chemical analog http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carbon - carbon . As the eighth most common element in the universe by mass, silicon occasionally occurs as the pure free element in nature, but is more widely distributed in dusts, planetoids and planets as various forms of http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Silicon_dioxide - silicon dioxide or http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Silicate - silicate . On Earth, silicon is the second most abundant element (after http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oxygen - Silicon has many industrial uses. Elemental silicon is the principal component of most http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Semiconductor - semiconductor devices, most importantly http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Integrated_circuits - integrated circuits or microchips. Silicon is widely used in semiconductors because it remains a semiconductor at higher temperatures than the semiconductor http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Germanium - germanium and because its http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Passivation - native oxide is easily grown in a furnace and forms a better semiconductor/dielectric interface than almost all other material combinations.

In the form of silica and silicates, silicon forms useful http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glass - glasses , http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cement - cements , and http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ceramic - ceramics . It is also a component of http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Silicone - silicones , a class-name for various synthetic plastic substances made of silicon, oxygen, carbon, germanium, and hydrogen, often confused with silicon itself.

Silicon is an essential element in biology, although only tiny traces of it appear to be required by animals. It is much more important to the metabolism of plants, particularly many grasses, and http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Silicic_acid - silicic acid (a type of silica) forms the basis of the striking array of protective shells of the microscopic http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diatoms - diatoms .

Chuurs all



Posted By: Badfish
Date Posted: 21 May 2007 at 4:35pm
Classic! Tackle Evangelists!!!



I've seen those hotshotz crab rigs in the shops, I just thought they were to expensive.

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http://www.legasea.co.nz" rel="nofollow">


Posted By: ThomasW
Date Posted: 21 May 2007 at 5:24pm
All soft plastics on the market are biodegradable. Some would take longer then others but it is only a matter of time before they all break down.

Actually silicon based products should be weaker then Carbon based products because silicon does not have a tendency to form double or triple bonds which are stronger then single bonds.


Posted By: get hooked
Date Posted: 21 May 2007 at 5:42pm
Originally posted by Badfish Badfish wrote:

Classic! Tackle Evangelists!!!



I've seen those hotshotz crab rigs in the shops, I just thought they were to expensive.
 
The Crab "rigs" as you refer, are actuallly a Mister Twister Scented Crab with a (very good) 5/0 Mutsu recurve hook set in it ready to fish.
This concept is to allow those new to soft plastic bait fishing to try a successful product already for the water.Smile
 
It takes the guess work out of the equation really so instead of having a packet of plastic smelly things at one's disposal, wondering how to set them up or rig them, this is ready for action.Wink
I know of many fishos who have spent the comparably miniscule 3 to 4 bucks for this neat scented lure, and go out and outfish their mates. As many as 7 Snapper were reported caught on just one of these "too expensive" offerings.
I wonder how much these are expected to sell for if just a few bucks for a proven lure is considered too much??Confused
 
Compare this, a packet of 5 Gulp crabs for $12 with no hooks against a few bucks for a Mister Twister crab with a hook already in it, and it doesn't dissolve if not put back into it's packet.


Posted By: ThomasW
Date Posted: 21 May 2007 at 6:13pm
Storm (rigged with VMC hooked baed jig heads), Tsunami Pro (rigged with Mustard Ultra Points jig heads) sell packs of 6 2" Soft Plastics for around $8.00

That is about $1.33 each and ready to fish.

While Hot Shotz 2" Crabs sell for $3.50 each and rigged with just a hook.

Gulps sell for around $2.40 each (@$12) and $2 each (@$10). A quality worm hook generally sell for $0.75 each. So a rigged Gulp crab costs around $2.75

I would be tempted to buy a pack of 5 rigged Hot Shotz crabs if they sell for around $12-$14.

Selling items indivually always means a larger proption of the cost of the item is 'packaging'.


Posted By: get hooked
Date Posted: 21 May 2007 at 6:40pm
So, pretty soon, you will all be able to buy a pack of crabs from the Mister Twister range, scented/Exude product, and the end user can make the choice. (Thanks Kilwell)
 
The comment re packaging is quite right and each individually handled product is probably higher in price than a bunch of them relatively speaking.
 
This is the same rule of retail whether it be bread buns or Scented Crabs.
 
At least we all have a selection from which to make one's own decision.
 
I wonder what the woman in Whitianga thought of her $3.50 investment for "something different to try" that provided her and her family with 7 Snapper that day. Ask her son, who waited on the steps of the tackle shop from 7 30 a.m the next morning, to get some more of "those crabs mum got yesterday" so he wouldn't be outfished by Mum again.
 
What price does one put on that?
I hear a Mastercard advert coming along............oooooooh priceless!


Posted By: Finatic
Date Posted: 21 May 2007 at 6:49pm
Enough of the talk! Get these flucken Exude things out there quick smart! I never knew the Hot Shots ones already out there had these magical potions of them... I'm gonna get some tomorrow!

I saw them in the shops and thought they were just rubber too. Better put them in some more informative packaging I suggest.



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What's the cheapest type of meat? Dear balls. They're under a buck.


Posted By: Uncle
Date Posted: 21 May 2007 at 8:24pm
Just my opinion but why would anyone want to use an "inert" crab, or two as a lure/sConfused
Fishing plastics is about movement IMHO & I reckon a plastic immitation of something that is less than mobile would be best replaced by a lump of humble skipjack.
Unless of course, it's a spastic crabLOL


Posted By: get hooked
Date Posted: 21 May 2007 at 8:31pm
Hi Simon,
These rigs all have information relative to the product, clearly readable as they hang on the shop wall.
They are under the HOT SHOTZ brand and are sub-named as "Exude Grubz Scented Rigs" or "Exude Nymphs Scented Rigs" or Exude Scented Crabs. The Crabs are called Surf Crab, Sand Crab, Rock Crab, Fire n Ice or Irresistable.
All these products also have the Mister Twister logo inside the packs and it may sometimes be possible to see the Tuff-Flex Exude Plastic Technology logo in the pack too, where applicable.
Hard to show everybit of info when you gotta show the product too.
 
Have a look in the latest Trade a Boat mag, (about page 104 I think), for a write up on them.
 
The unscented rigs are identified by specific name, such as CURLY GRUBS or G-GRUBS. These are fairly new and not available everywhere just yet.
 
Hope that is of assistance for you so you know what to look for.


Posted By: Finatic
Date Posted: 21 May 2007 at 8:33pm
Don't knock them crabs Uncle

I've had good results on the Gulp crabs. If they've got smelly stuff on them these might be all good aswell. I reckon a few gurnards mihgt like the looks ofg them too

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What's the cheapest type of meat? Dear balls. They're under a buck.


Posted By: get hooked
Date Posted: 21 May 2007 at 8:34pm
Originally posted by Uncle Uncle wrote:

Just my opinion but why would anyone want to use an "inert" crab, or two as a lure/sConfused
Fishing plastics is about movement IMHO & I reckon a plastic immitation of something that is less than mobile would be best replaced by a lump of humble skipjack.
Unless of course, it's a spastic crabLOL
 
You are quite right "Uncle", I believe that Fresh IS Best too, however there is a place for softies as we all know.
These "inert" crabs, are best fished with minimal movement in order to simulate the real thing and "stimulate" a real attack.....Wink


Posted By: Finatic
Date Posted: 21 May 2007 at 8:35pm
Thanks Get Hooked. It that case It might have just been the unscented jobbies I saw. I cant remeber now because I'm a little pissed.

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What's the cheapest type of meat? Dear balls. They're under a buck.


Posted By: of2fsh
Date Posted: 21 May 2007 at 8:53pm
A little pissed ..LOL....on me 7th corona feeling the same


Posted By: Bushpig
Date Posted: 22 May 2007 at 7:59am
Originally posted by Phats Phats wrote:

Hehehehe
 
Bushy Goes fishing with the Gulp guys and look at him
 
The guys making the money on this stuff must be loving getting their "sales men" out there.


Why is questioning useing petrochemical lures interpreted as supporting gulp Phats? As I have already stated in this thread. It would be good to see some competitors to them in this market.

Did you miss that or are you just defensive cause you like to you plastic?


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I would rather laugh with the Sinners, than cry with the Saints


Posted By: Bushpig
Date Posted: 22 May 2007 at 8:06am
Originally posted by Sea-Sharpe Sea-Sharpe wrote:

Well I suppose I better "wade in here" to put the case forward for the "petrochemical" cause.... And yea I have a vested interest but there�s two sides to every story so please hear me out.

 

<snip>



Sea Sharpe

What effect do you think it has on the fish if they eat silicon versus eating a food source lure?


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I would rather laugh with the Sinners, than cry with the Saints


Posted By: get hooked
Date Posted: 22 May 2007 at 8:13am
Could be an interesting come back for the "Tackle Evanglelists" to promote stone sinkers to balance the PC time wasters talking about petro chemical lures.
 
It is not that silly considering the amount of TOXIC LEAD lying in our pristine waters........Shocked
 
Oh so sorry members, I fear I may have sidetracked this thread, I'll just delete that......here goes......oops hit the wrong button


Posted By: Bushpig
Date Posted: 22 May 2007 at 8:35am
Originally posted by get hooked get hooked wrote:

Could be an interesting come back for the "Tackle Evanglelists" to promote stone sinkers to balance the PC time wasters talking about petro chemical lures.
 
It is not that silly considering the amount of TOXIC LEAD lying in our pristine waters........Shocked
 
Oh so sorry members, I fear I may have sidetracked this thread, I'll just delete that......here goes......oops hit the wrong button


Ok I will bite. Is it PC time wasting as you have a vested interest in selling lures and dont give a stuff about the effects. Its more about what we are getting fish to eat and the effects than what is lying on the bottome of the sea floor.


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I would rather laugh with the Sinners, than cry with the Saints


Posted By: get hooked
Date Posted: 22 May 2007 at 9:00am
Quite simply Bushy, this is a sensitive area for some but the point I made was that the lead sinkers are far more prolific on the sea bed and provide a far greater threat than bits of soft stuff straying around.
 
This is a fact of fishes life as everyone that goes fishing with a sinker uses lead, whether they fish simple dropper rigs, plastic, feathers or whatever.
 
I would therefore suggest (and only suggest) that if a fish ate a bit of lead, it would be stuck with it whereas if it ate a bit of soft bait/plastic, it may well pass it through the proverbial poo shute.
 
Hands up here, no scientific evidence to support this thought but what the hell.
At least the soft stuff wouldn't make the fishes eyes water when passing through.Wink
I have actually written an article some 7 years ago on stone sinkers in a publication that is no longer.
Wainuiomata Beach for example, is littered with brilliant sinkers for this and I am in support of their use.
If you are concerned about what fish eat, best you buy fresh (which of course is best) and don't contribute to the bank accounts of those who have commercialised soft baits any longer.
 
(I did say at the start of this reply, that this IS a sensitive area and I do not wish to enter a political scrap over this topic, thanks)


Posted By: Bushpig
Date Posted: 22 May 2007 at 9:16am
Actually G-hooked,

I am concerned about what a fsih is getting feed in the name of our sport and as such I started this thread to see what the general thougfht was. You see I have made a choice to use a food based lure. Something that I dont think would effect the fish any more than a pilchard would. Do you think that a silicon lure would be the same?

Lets not side tract to lead to deflect the possible effects


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I would rather laugh with the Sinners, than cry with the Saints


Posted By: Capt Asparagus
Date Posted: 22 May 2007 at 9:34am
Stone sinkers... nice rounded beach/river stones, graded to different sizes, with a little metal ring superglued to the top...not a bad idea really. Probably cheaper than lead too I would hope!
Truly they would have ot be better for the seafloor than lead lying everywhere!
You would have to watch out for fly-by-night shysters though, make sure some slick con-man didn't start using pumice. :-)
Cheers, Stu.


Posted By: A C
Date Posted: 22 May 2007 at 9:35am
[QUOTE=get hooked]
I would therefore suggest (and only suggest) that if a fish ate a bit of lead, it would be stuck with it whereas if it ate a bit of soft bait/plastic, it may well pass it through the proverbial poo shute.
 
Hands up here, no scientific evidence to support this thought but what the hell.

 [/QUOTE

It doesn't take long for them to vent the rubber. I lost an SP whilst drift fishing about three weeks ago. We were doing drifts of about a mile or so and the SP was grabbed and ripped from the hook in the early part of the day. Roughly four hours later when drifiting over that same area one of our team caught a small snapper ( about 25 -30cm ). As he brought it up to release it we noticed it's vent had something lodged half way out. Upon inspection it turned out to be my lost SP........I know this because of the cut off nose. It was still in near perfect nick and to prove a point I re-hooked it and caught another snapper with it.


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Aye-Aye cloth eyes.


Posted By: get hooked
Date Posted: 22 May 2007 at 9:37am

OK, you have drawn me into your web but I'm not staying for long on this topic.

 
My thoughts as said are that there are far more things to worry about in the waters than silcone (as you say it).
 
Oil residues from engines, 6 pack holders that kill penguins, lead as said earlier (and lead, for the record, is in all the jigs we chuck in the briny too) it it absolutely endless Bushy.
 
"You see I have made a choice to use a food based lure. Something that I dont think would effect the fish any more than a pilchard would. Do you think that a silicon lure would be the same? "
I do not believe an artificial lure is at all as close to natural as a Pilly and anyone who says or thinks it is needs to go back to school (or at least stop listening to the "Tackle Evangelists")
A "food based lure" is artificial and despite it being commercially viable in our market, while it is artificial it will have something in it that ain't that healthy. If it was that OK, ask the Tackle Evangelists to eat one on stage in front of you.
If you are concerned, as said below earlier, head back to the bait supplier of your choice and buy fresh, natural bait.
 
If you wish to continue fishing with an artificial food based bait flavoured with natural aminos etc etc, then make sure the hook does the job and bring the fish to the boat, remove all offensive materials from fishes gob and release or bin it.
It's that simple really.
My two cents worth......
 


Posted By: Bushpig
Date Posted: 22 May 2007 at 9:50am
A food based lure is exactly that. Made of a food based product. You may not want to eat it but do you eat paper or cardboard? Yes its artificial, but at least its not a silicon.  Would you eat your lures ?

Solicon is just that. I see you avoided answering the question about the effects of eating silicon on a fish.

You bandy Tackle Evangelists around, perhaps a term should be coined for the sellers of silicon lures.


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I would rather laugh with the Sinners, than cry with the Saints


Posted By: Bushpig
Date Posted: 22 May 2007 at 9:52am
Originally posted by A C A C wrote:


It doesn't take long for them to vent the rubber. I lost an SP whilst drift fishing about three weeks ago. We were doing drifts of about a mile or so and the SP was grabbed and ripped from the hook in the early part of the day. Roughly four hours later when drifiting over that same area one of our team caught a small snapper ( about 25 -30cm ). As he brought it up to release it we noticed it's vent had something lodged half way out. Upon inspection it turned out to be my lost SP........I know this because of the cut off nose. It was still in near perfect nick and to prove a point I re-hooked it and caught another snapper with it.


Hardly sientific evidence AC, but its interesting to note that it was lodged?


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I would rather laugh with the Sinners, than cry with the Saints


Posted By: Phats
Date Posted: 22 May 2007 at 10:07am
Originally posted by Bushpig Bushpig wrote:



Why is questioning useing petrochemical lures interpreted as supporting gulp Phats? As I have already stated in this thread. It would be good to see some competitors to them in this market.

Did you miss that or are you just defensive cause you like to you plastic?
 

Crying suits you

 

I am pleased to see you are going to be increasing your line weight too ? So you dont have to play fish out for up to 10mins for a "pannie" , greatly reducing the chance of their survival if released ?  I suppose thats different because its "fun"

 

Its Naeive to think "foodsource" dont harm the fish. Pleased to be proved wrong if there is evidence they don�t , in fact would love to be wrong.

How many Gulps did you loose on the weekend into the ocean compared to zero sluggo's lost ?

 

Did you miss that or are you just defensive cause you like to you plastic?�
Did you miss the fact I used �plastic� to catch 3 fish (on the same plastic�.which is still in my boat not in the ocean) and the rest of the time used �Food source plastics�


I accept that when I go fishing I have an impact on fish and the environment.


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A positive attitude may not solve all your problems, but it will annoy enough people to make it worth the effort.


Posted By: Kezza
Date Posted: 22 May 2007 at 10:11am
the "stone/rocks" sinker concept is alive and well in Northland, in fact we've filmed a show were a local epoxies a small swivel to different weight rocks and uses them in a sacrificial manner......he caught plenty of snapper....the show will be on air later this year....

t'was amusing when he turned up to the boat with a bucket full o' rocks!

Now that is interesting AC.....was it a petro-silicon-hybrid-mulaky or a 'food' based softbait that had been all but digested?


Posted By: get hooked
Date Posted: 22 May 2007 at 10:16am
Good Grief!
 
A "food based lure" is artificial and despite it being commercially viable in our market, while it is artificial it will have something in it that ain't that healthy.
 
For the record, Silicone IS artificial.
My GUESS is that............
SILICONE IS PROBABLY NOT GOOD FOR A FISHES DIET.
(nothing scientific to substantiate this as said previous, but........)
 
There you go Bushy, I have not avoided your question and further have given you a whole lot of other interesting stuff to think about.
 
I appreciate your concern and hope your question is now suitably addressed.
I also note your concern about wholesalers who bring exciting new concepts to the market for you to improve your fishing results too.
 
If it were not for new concepts silicone or otherwise, your fishing exploits may become rather boring doing the same old same old.....


Posted By: Finatic
Date Posted: 22 May 2007 at 10:17am
Lead sinkers/stone sinkers... I can't imagine a fish enjoying having to shiz out either of the two ... But come to think of it � I've never heard of fish going around eating sinkers.

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What's the cheapest type of meat? Dear balls. They're under a buck.


Posted By: A C
Date Posted: 22 May 2007 at 10:19am
It was a 4" nuke chook.........hence the small snapper. It was in perfect nick- the chook I mean ( and the snapper ) and it certainly didn't put the snapper off eating another one.

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Aye-Aye cloth eyes.


Posted By: long john
Date Posted: 22 May 2007 at 10:29am
I doubt silicon has a detrimental effect on fish as it is used in a variety of medical procedures(breast implants spring to mind (with monotonous regularityClown)) because it is relatively inert.(though long term exposure has it's risks) I would hazard a guess that if we can put it in our bodies, it shouldn't harm a fishes gastrintestinal tract.
 
We have all done autopsies on our fishy victims and wondered how that limpet would've felt on the way out. Surely a soft bait would be heaven in comparison?
As a dirty old spearo, I've seen many of these things fouling up the spots I like to dive. It's a shame really and I collect them up (along with pilly bags, old mono etc, etc) and bin them back on land. I found an absolutely ginormous stripey blue mackeral type of thing a foot long at McGregors, Aldermans a week back, along with 10s of metres of mono. As I said before, a shame


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Proud member of the Glen Innes Spearfishing Club


Posted By: Kezza
Date Posted: 22 May 2007 at 10:31am
again interesting AC...you would think that if GULP was digestible and contained some sort of usuable energy (food) the snapper would have been more than happy holding on to a meal like that? and very interesting about it being lodged as well...Clap...all non scientific of course!

let the games begin.


Posted By: Kezza
Date Posted: 22 May 2007 at 10:35am
"wondered how that limpet would've felt on the way out"

you are not wrong mate....caught a nice one out the back of the Barrier last year that had a complete limpet the size of an average blokes fish in it's guts....all very intriguing.....although the last thing on that snappers mind was an iky-spike, so its next toilet behavior wasn't really an issue.....iky spike? dumping the limpet?....i did it a favour really!

mmmmmm...silicon!


Posted By: Bushpig
Date Posted: 22 May 2007 at 10:40am
Originally posted by Phats Phats wrote:

Originally posted by Bushpig Bushpig wrote:



Why is questioning useing petrochemical lures interpreted as supporting gulp Phats? As I have already stated in this thread. It would be good to see some competitors to them in this market.

Did you miss that or are you just defensive cause you like to you plastic?
 

Crying suits you

 

I am pleased to see you are going to be increasing your line weight too ? So you dont have to play fish out for up to 10mins for a "pannie" , greatly reducing the chance of their survival if released ?  I suppose thats different because its "fun"

 

Its Naeive to think "foodsource" dont harm the fish. Pleased to be proved wrong if there is evidence they don�t , in fact would love to be wrong.

How many Gulps did you loose on the weekend into the ocean compared to zero sluggo's lost ?

 

Did you miss that or are you just defensive cause you like to you plastic?�
Did you miss the fact I used �plastic� to catch 3 fish (on the same plastic�.which is still in my boat not in the ocean) and the rest of the time used �Food source plastics�


I accept that when I go fishing I have an impact on fish and the environment.


All fish were released healthy. But thats a different argument and it could be seen as very detrimental hauling them up on 10kg and busting swim bladders rather than gently pulling them up and not doing that. But like I said, a different argument.

Now that you have entered the fray, Phats. Why do you deam it necessary to enhance your sloggos with stimulate?




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I would rather laugh with the Sinners, than cry with the Saints


Posted By: Badfish
Date Posted: 22 May 2007 at 10:40am
I think if we're going to get down to it, saying things probably are and aren't good for fish to eat is besides the point. Hooking the thing in the mouth and making it fight for it's life probably isn't good for it either....
(but I will say, fish like snapper eat, digest and s**t out muscle shells etc)
If you ask me the issue is more with the littering aspect of it.
I fish gulp and slug go lures. Out of 3 packs of 10 slug go's I've used up only 2 has been lost in the water (one from lossing the trace in a snag).



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http://www.legasea.co.nz" rel="nofollow">


Posted By: KeenAs
Date Posted: 22 May 2007 at 10:42am

Personally, i'm far more concerned for the poor Leather Jackets. ..  now do they or do they not eat alot of plastic??



Posted By: Bushpig
Date Posted: 22 May 2007 at 10:43am
Originally posted by Kezza Kezza wrote:

again interesting AC...you would think that if GULP was digestible and contained some sort of usuable energy (food) the snapper would have been more than happy holding on to a meal like that? and very interesting about it being lodged as well...Clap...all non scientific of course!

let the games begin.


Do you think a snapper is smart enough to hold digestible food and vent non digestible at will or did it just vent due to stress?


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I would rather laugh with the Sinners, than cry with the Saints


Posted By: Kezza
Date Posted: 22 May 2007 at 10:53am
buggered if I know mate.....

but I do know that once something is inside one's guts it is very difficult to make a mental/smart decision about the next course of action (unless one happens to be anorexic/bulimic).....either it get ingested, vomited or excreted depending on it's digestibility and level of agreeance with the eater.

when I typed this:

"the snapper would have been more than happy holding on to a meal like that?"

it was from a biological p.o.v, not suggesting snapper or anything is smart enough to dictate what one's guts do and don't....catwalk models might be smart enough thou!


Posted By: Reel Deal
Date Posted: 22 May 2007 at 10:54am
The question I guess when broken down is, if both baits caught the same, had the same action, and stayed on the same and from what I am hearing it will shortly be at that stage. Will there be a market for the non food based baits?? Kind of hoping the answer is no. Excusing some of our fishing brothers out there with sunburned necks.
 
2 weekends ago my boat landed 18 snapper for the bin and easily twice that in throw backers and used 5 Gulp baits. One pink shad caught 11 snapper and 3 gurnard before being lost.
 
Last weekend 12 snapper and other types of fish and used 11 baits???
 
Also a gulp flicked off at boat to be taken and flown away with by molly bird...
 
  


Posted By: Phats
Date Posted: 22 May 2007 at 11:19am
Originally posted by Bushpig Bushpig wrote:



All fish were released healthy. But thats a different argument and it could be seen as very detrimental hauling them up on 10kg and busting swim bladders rather than gently pulling them up and not doing that. But like I said, a different argument.
 Translation: I cannot argue with that but dont want to stop having fun on the light gear so will deflect

Now that you have entered the fray, Phats. Why do you deam it necessary to enhance your sloggos with stimulate?

Man, I thought you could do better than that.

 

Simple answer there, because I can and because I wanted to try it. It was the first time I had, and it worked well

I�ve seen you spray stimulate all over fresh baits��why did you deem it necessary to do that ? �..surely something 100% ala natural doesn�t need �help� ?



 
 


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A positive attitude may not solve all your problems, but it will annoy enough people to make it worth the effort.


Posted By: Rainbow
Date Posted: 22 May 2007 at 11:36am
As a newcomer to this thread I cant help noticing a certain amount of advertorial flavour in some of the posts.     Although I can only applaud any move to greater environmental sensitivity in my experience that dialog could more productivley begin with ultra light line fishing, choice of hooks, inappropriate release practices to name but a few of a host of questionable fishing practices rather than via a debate about silicone Sps versus digestible ones.
 
Perhaps a much more pertinent question is why are SP lures so fragile that we are having this debate at all.    Surely with todays chemistry knowhow a more durable material must  be available to make SPs that last a lot longer?      
 
Answer: Not while there are plenty of suckers out there who gladly hand over $$$$$$$ for grossly over priced lures with a built in "near zero" life expectancy.  
 
Rainbow 
 


Posted By: KeenAs
Date Posted: 22 May 2007 at 11:53am
Snotex share prices just soared


Posted By: Accident Prone
Date Posted: 22 May 2007 at 11:54am
Originally posted by Rainbow Rainbow wrote:

 
   Surely with todays chemistry knowhow a more durable material must  be available to make SPs that last a lot longer?      
 


There certainly is....... Strike Kings!. Thumbs%20Up


Posted By: Finatic
Date Posted: 22 May 2007 at 11:59am
Was it the merits of materials that breakdown or materials that don't that we were talking about here?

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What's the cheapest type of meat? Dear balls. They're under a buck.


Posted By: Peter da Squid
Date Posted: 22 May 2007 at 12:19pm
Who gives a **** really?

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Good for Nuthin


Posted By: Redfinger
Date Posted: 22 May 2007 at 12:21pm
classic!


Posted By: Finatic
Date Posted: 22 May 2007 at 12:22pm


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What's the cheapest type of meat? Dear balls. They're under a buck.


Posted By: Peter da Squid
Date Posted: 22 May 2007 at 12:26pm
LOL apologize for my wrongs

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Good for Nuthin


Posted By: Rainbow
Date Posted: 22 May 2007 at 12:32pm
Finatic, I take it that you accept the fact that SPs can not be made so as not to litter the seafloor or end up in a fish's gut.
 
Since this thread as an underlying conservation theme let me ask a further question:   If SBs are more potent fish catcher as many on this forum claim then what impact does this new method have on the already stressed snapper fishery of the Hauraki Gulf.
 
Since there is such a thing as generational memory loss I include a picture from the sixties of Gulf party boats using nothing but handlines.
 


Posted By: Finatic
Date Posted: 22 May 2007 at 12:38pm
Originally posted by Rainbow Rainbow wrote:

Finatic, I take it that you accept the fact that SPs can not be made so as not to litter the seafloor or end up in a fish's gut.


Can you unjumble that for me please Rainbow? I'm not 100% with it today. Thanks

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What's the cheapest type of meat? Dear balls. They're under a buck.


Posted By: KeenAs
Date Posted: 22 May 2007 at 12:43pm
Originally posted by Finatic Finatic wrote:

I'm not 100% with it today.
 
as opposed to........?Tongue


Posted By: Finatic
Date Posted: 22 May 2007 at 12:48pm

Most days actually . It's hard to turn down icy cold wets when it's on the company

Rainbow, do you have 'stats' showing that the snapper fishery is stressed?

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What's the cheapest type of meat? Dear balls. They're under a buck.


Posted By: Rainbow
Date Posted: 22 May 2007 at 12:49pm
Finatic, my apologies for thinking "outside" an otherwise circular argument.


Posted By: Finatic
Date Posted: 22 May 2007 at 12:52pm
Originally posted by Rainbow Rainbow wrote:

Finatic, my apologies for thinking "outside" an otherwise�circular argument.


No. seriously. I was having difficulties diciphering your question.

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What's the cheapest type of meat? Dear balls. They're under a buck.


Posted By: Rainbow
Date Posted: 22 May 2007 at 1:37pm
I was simply asking why do we accept that with todays technology soft baits can't be made more durable?   As for my contention of a stressed Gulf fishery it all depends on what baseline you start any comparison. 
 
The problem with intergeneration memory is that we all start off with out own base line and judge everything accordingly.    If you asked those that were fishing from this boat ( I am having trouble posting the picture) in the sixties about the status of today's fish stocks you would get an entirely differnt answer than from a person whose fishing record only dates back a few years.   
 
I hope this isnt too complicated to grasp.
 
Rainbow  


Posted By: Bushpig
Date Posted: 22 May 2007 at 1:48pm
Originally posted by Peter da Squid Peter da Squid wrote:

Who gives a **** really?


Noe one Squid, but its been fun debating the subject.

Have you heard the rumor that some pictures in the SP Hall of Fame have been faked, apparently its alleged that lure swapping fro photo purposes has occurred.

I for one and shocked Shocked


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I would rather laugh with the Sinners, than cry with the Saints


Posted By: Kezza
Date Posted: 22 May 2007 at 1:48pm
Rainbow......

love that picture but it does paint a somewhat blurry picture because in my opinion if you loaded up that many fishos on a suitable sized boat ,  fished the middle ground of the Hauraki Gulf with what ever method you desired at the present and told all your punters to keep all the fish up to their limit you'd be able to take a very similar picture....or maybe just get a commercial operator to empty their hold on to their bow rails.

No doubt about it there would have been more snapper around in "those" days, but they are still around if you know where to look I guess.

Let's not muddy this one up with human sentiment.....

"biodegradable" VS "plastic"?


Posted By: Finatic
Date Posted: 22 May 2007 at 1:50pm
Now I'm getting ya Rainbow. A biodegradable soft bait that is durable like the other rubber baits out there at the moment. Sure, why can't they develop these?

Caption: "We went out fishing and all we caught was these pesky snapper"

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What's the cheapest type of meat? Dear balls. They're under a buck.


Posted By: Kezza
Date Posted: 22 May 2007 at 1:56pm
" Have you heard the rumor that some pictures in the SP Hall of Fame have been faked, apparently its alleged that lure swapping fro photo purposes has occurred."

I can categorically say with hand on heart that none of the photos presented in the Soft bait Hall of Fame thread that have been taken with my camera or of any of the fish I caught have had "lures swapped".....tidied up and presented better for the shot most likely, but I also take care in making sure the fish is rid of blood and other unsightly clutter to capture a more presentable image....


Posted By: Adam Scott
Date Posted: 22 May 2007 at 2:06pm
Originally posted by Finatic Finatic wrote:

Now I'm getting ya Rainbow. A biodegradable soft bait that is durable like the other rubber baits out there at the moment. Sure, why can't they develop these?

Caption: "We went out fishing and all we caught was these pesky snapper"
 
$$$$$$ ofcourse Si. Thats the reason. This is a marketers dream, not only do they get you with the expensive rods/reels but the on going cost of having to buy SPbait that is $2 a tail and lasts on average 2 fish. If they lasted years the TAS thread would be halved.
You dont see many tackle retailers promoting the fact that you can catch a feed of snapper on a $5 handline, smelly old bait(that is appearently biodigradable) and that it too is pretty good fun.


Posted By: Finatic
Date Posted: 22 May 2007 at 2:14pm
That's exactly what was going thru my mind Adam...

Which manufacturer in their right mind would put out the 'perfect' product? Not just fishing, but anything. Sure, people might buy it, but what happens say everyone buys one of this this 'perfect' product? What are you going to be able to sell them after that???

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What's the cheapest type of meat? Dear balls. They're under a buck.


Posted By: Badfish
Date Posted: 22 May 2007 at 2:22pm
Goes the same for light bulbs and batteries etc.
Surely you can't resonably expect a manufacturing company to make a product for you once, thats taking this thread over into dream land.

Nothing wrong with asking for a better product, sure. They're out there now, just has to come with compromise.

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http://www.legasea.co.nz" rel="nofollow">


Posted By: Bushpig
Date Posted: 22 May 2007 at 2:42pm
Originally posted by Adam Scott Adam Scott wrote:

 
$$$$$$ ofcourse Si. Thats the reason. This is a marketers dream, not only do they get you with the expensive rods/reels but the on going cost of having to buy SPbait that is $2 a tail and lasts on average 2 fish. If they lasted years the TAS thread would be halved.
You dont see many tackle retailers promoting the fact that you can catch a feed of snapper on a $5 handline, smelly old bait(that is appearently biodigradable) and that it too is pretty good fun.


Adam

as a SP convert, unless you are going shallow and hunting big winter trophies, SP's are lots more fun. In my opinion


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I would rather laugh with the Sinners, than cry with the Saints


Posted By: Peter da Squid
Date Posted: 22 May 2007 at 3:02pm
"Have you heard the rumor that some pictures in the SP Hall of Fame have been faked, apparently its alleged that lure swapping fro photo purposes has occurred.

I for one and shocked Shocked"
 
 
thats pretty sad
please do tell who did this!


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Good for Nuthin


Posted By: Boulder
Date Posted: 22 May 2007 at 3:07pm
Originally posted by Bushpig Bushpig wrote:


as a SP convert, unless you are going shallow and hunting big winter trophies, SP's are lots more fun. In my opinion
Translation   "only way I have been able to catch a snapper at all lately"LOL


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http://www.boulderguiding.co.nz">

http://www.boulderguiding.co.nz">www.boulderguiding.co.nz



Posted By: Bushpig
Date Posted: 22 May 2007 at 3:24pm
Originally posted by Boulder Boulder wrote:

Originally posted by Bushpig Bushpig wrote:


as a SP convert, unless you are going shallow and hunting big winter trophies, SP's are lots more fun. In my opinion
Translation   "only way I have been able to catch a snapper at all lately"LOL


True dat Clap


Originally posted by Peter da Squid Peter da Squid wrote:

 
thats pretty sad
please do tell who did this!


As I said, it was a rumor and I woudnt want to tarnish reputations with out facts. But rest assured if I get facts I will out the perpetrators


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I would rather laugh with the Sinners, than cry with the Saints


Posted By: Sea-Sharpe
Date Posted: 22 May 2007 at 3:28pm
Yes lets have some evidence of the faked piccies.. I for one as Kezza has stated and say that none of my photo's are pimped up, I will tidy a fish up blood wise and try to hold it so it shows off the bait but thats it really.
 
Now in regards to the eating silicon v bio bait bushpig I see what you mean, however as with most things where theres no evidence really for or against its bloody hard to make an unbiased scientific observation... Suffice to say from my "camp" and as noted on this thread snapper are real garbage gutzes so if they can pass kina spikes, mussel shells, Hooks? they soft baits/plastics must be easier surely.
 
With regards to the "legendary" japanese lakeshore littered with soft baits?? WTF baits sink so I would suggest if you have a problem on the lakes shore it might be from dirty buggers chucking their plastics on the ground rather than disposing of them.. which leads I am afraid to another observation on my part, fully biased to my products and mentioned again in this thread.. and that is I just dont lose that many SP's to fish, the majority of the time that get that munted I take them off the hook and put them in the rubbish bag, if I go lose some tails to reefies I tend to move on to more productive spots.


Posted By: A C
Date Posted: 22 May 2007 at 5:01pm
Originally posted by Finatic Finatic wrote:

That's exactly what was going thru my mind Adam...

Which manufacturer in their right mind would put out the 'perfect' product? Not just fishing, but anything. Sure, people might buy it, but what happens say everyone buys one of this this 'perfect' product? What are you going to be able to sell them after that???


I certainly would if I could perfect a product like that...........who in their right mind wouldn't want to retire with a zillion bucks in the bank and travel the world having a bash at every species available with the "perfect bait" .................Yes sir I'll have a dish full of that thanks. Big%20smile

I wouldn't need to give a toss if I never sold so much as a wooden clothes peg ever again.


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Aye-Aye cloth eyes.


Posted By: Boulder
Date Posted: 22 May 2007 at 5:04pm
What about a better pot plant holder then ACWink

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http://www.boulderguiding.co.nz">

http://www.boulderguiding.co.nz">www.boulderguiding.co.nz



Posted By: A C
Date Posted: 22 May 2007 at 5:05pm
Originally posted by Peter da Squid Peter da Squid wrote:

"Have you heard the rumor that some pictures in the SP Hall of Fame have been faked, apparently its alleged that lure swapping fro photo purposes has occurred.

I for one and shocked Shocked"
 
 
thats pretty sad
please do tell who did this!


Hmmm interesting. The big be-achers in the hall of fame that were taken on my tub were definitely not doctored photo's.


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Aye-Aye cloth eyes.


Posted By: A C
Date Posted: 22 May 2007 at 5:09pm
Originally posted by Boulder Boulder wrote:

What about a better pot plant holder then ACWink


The one in Majorca worked just fine thanks Wink


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Aye-Aye cloth eyes.



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